How could Penguin kill my top ten rank and promote this garbage page to a #5 spot
-
Hey,
Before penguin, I had a #9 rank for the term "yoga poses". So as many of us are doing, I started looking at my link profile... and yes, there were around 300 links from an old yoga news website (anchor: yoga poses)... that lead to the page on my site optimized for this term. The problem is they took the site down, but not properly... I.E. they generate a "not available" message for browsers, but underneath, I guess the bots can still index all the pages... so I guess they were interpreting these links as coming from a cloaked site.
So, I was able to get them to remove the links... webmaster tools reports half of them gone now.
What I don't get though... is how Google can give this garbage page a #5 spot for a competitive term like "yoga poses"...
Check out http://www.ebmyoga.com/beginyoga.html and compare it to
my page... http://www.yogaclassplan.com/yoga-poses/
This page leads to highly quality 100% unique yoga pose articles... in my mind we deliver so much more value than the site with a #5 rank.
I don't understand. Any insight?
Thanks,
-
That looks logical to me! Plus, from a usability standpoint, the reader can better understand how to navigate the content.
I do wonder if you should go a little larger on the images and have the category title, image and description all be the same width stacked one on top of the other. This is not for an SEO reason, but based on the preferences of the average yoga demographic. This arrangement would also (albeit slightly) increase readability of the description.
-
Thanks Cole,
I was thinking of editing the template like in the image attached below. Add text for each category and then thumbnails below that lead to the full article. What do you think?
-
I see that you do have fantastic content for each pose. That's great.
I would place an image for every pose on this page. Include a short description of that pose... and a link where visitor can get the full article.
When a visitor lands on this page they will be impressed with all of the poses and that you have additional information for each one.
I NEVER hesitate to show the visitor images of EVERYTHING that I have and then link to a more detailed page. I am not going to say the keywords that I have pages like this ranking for (with zero linkbuilding done by me) but you would probably be surprised at their difficulty. Huge image galleries linking to more detailed content are killler killer killer.
-
Hi Egol,
Thanks for your reply and it makes total sense... the problem for me is that if you look at the length of one of my pose articles, you will see there is no way I can post all this information on one page... so...
... I was thinking the following steps:
Please see wire frame attached:
1. Remove the right margin of this template to make it wider
2. Modify the header so that it speaks specifically to the pose articles... not the software
3. Insert say 150x150 images for each category of poses... I.E. arm balances etc... and then insert some text beside that image to further explain to the reader the type of poses they will find in this category.
4. Underneath this top level image and category text, I will insert thumb nail images and the pose name, which leads to the full article.
What do you think?
Thanks,
-
Connie,
For a living, I work with the health and wellness industries. Within that, about 75% of my clients are in the yoga world. I'm also a 200 hour Yoga Alliance certified yoga teacher. Not that those things help with SEO, but I have a unique understanding of the yoga world and lots of experience with, specifically, yoga-related websites.
I strongly recommend adding in images. Not stock photos, but images you take or produce yourself. They will need to be properly sized and tagged and all of that too, but from what I've seen with my clients, images really have a very positive impact. I know this is not true for all segments/industries, but in the yoga world—yes.
Not sure if you've seen yoga journal's pose finder index: http://www.yogajournal.com/poses/finder/browse_categories
YJ has invested a lot of money into the UX part of their site. Take note of what they are doing and see how you can improve.
Now, another benefit to the other site is that it's smaller, and simpler. Jamie Fernandez has the goods on 'why' for that as does ChangingHorizon.
Since you are using Wordpress (which is what we build all of our sites on) you need to get rid of any extra plugins you can possibly spare. Depending on what theme you are using, you may not need All in One SEO, however, I use this plugin on nearly all of our sites. Delete extra plugins.
Add pictures (even just 10 or 12) and see how that has an effect.
Also, you get points for your Sanskrit transliteration! Looks great. I've never seen your site before and am happy to have found it.
-
It may not look pretty, but your competitor has higher page authority, higher domain authority and an established domain. You also have a lot of scripts running on the page, including an 'All-in-One' SEO pack which means your page load speed is slow.
But I think EGOL really hits the nail on the head (as usual).
-
sometimes less is more and you might want to check your low domain authority links!
and remember Goggle does not care how the site looks it only cares for text and links.
You can learn from your competitors, do you want to!?
-
I whole-heartedly agree with EGOL. A few points to add:
- you may want to watch Rand's G+ Penguin Update video (11 minutes) https://plus.google.com/u/1/111294201325870406922/posts/MjLCYnwMdBB
The very first thing Rand shares is the Penguin update is NOT designed to immediately improve search results. It is designed to penalize sites which violated Google Guidelines.
- your site offers detailed pages on each individual yoga pose. Your competitor's site only offers a single yoga pose page as it is a much smaller site. Your competitor's site therefore provides more focus on this single page then your site offers.
I completely agree your site is higher quality overall. I would recommend adjusting your content to better match the main focus of the page.
-
Here are a few thoughts,
From a visitors point of view as it relates to someone looking for yoga poses..........
When landing on your competitions website, I see information about yoga poses, with descriptions and images. It shows me what I was looking for.
When visiting the url you provided for your site, right out of the gate, I see information about course outline development and no "yoga poses". I see a description saying "Designed Specifically for Yoga Teachers" So, I did not land on a page with the exact content I was looking for, so, I bounced.
I would consider developing some more yoga poses related content for the page.
-
Went to your page. Where are the poses??
I like the other guy's site because the pictures are right there. That's what I expected to find.
If I owned your site that page would have big photos for every pose right there and visible... generous descriptions will accompany each one. I would not expect people to click to them. People who arrive on a page like this want to see something. Give it to them is what I would do.
If you do that I bet your traffic will climb from long tail keywords and better ranking for your main term.
I would also cut back on spending the top 500 pixels of the page on design elements that are repeated across the site.
That's just opinion... but where I would bet my money.
(I have a page on a subject where I have lots of images - about the size of yours - each with a few sentence description. That page has about 60 images and 3000 words. It pulls in more traffic than an five pages on my site combined and is slowly climbing the SERPs for difficult terms. I do no linkbuilding. Pages with lots of images, big images and substantive text pull in links with no work from me.)
Got a burning SEO question?
Subscribe to Moz Pro to gain full access to Q&A, answer questions, and ask your own.
Browse Questions
Explore more categories
-
Moz Tools
Chat with the community about the Moz tools.
-
SEO Tactics
Discuss the SEO process with fellow marketers
-
Community
Discuss industry events, jobs, and news!
-
Digital Marketing
Chat about tactics outside of SEO
-
Research & Trends
Dive into research and trends in the search industry.
-
Support
Connect on product support and feature requests.
Related Questions
-
Does Google push down for not ranking top for branded keywords?
Hi all, Usually websites rank for their branded keywords. Some times third party websites takeover the websites for branded keywords. If there are more number of such queries where website is not ranking (top) for branded keywords, Google push down website in overall rankings? Any correlation? Thanks
Algorithm Updates | | vtmoz0 -
Rankings Change
Hi I've noticed some ranking drops on 15th Jan, I saw there was an update on Jan 8th - could this have had a knock on effect a week later?
Algorithm Updates | | BeckyKey0 -
Home page rank for keyword
Hi Mozers I have traded from my website balloon.co.uk for over 10 years. For a long while the site ranked first for the word 'balloon' across the UK on google.co.uk (first out of 41 million). Around the time Penguin launched the site began to drop and currently sits on about page 5. What's confusing is that for a search on 'balloons' ('s' on the end of balloon) it ranks 2nd in the location of Birmingham where I'm based. That's 2nd in the real search rather than a map local search. But - if I search 'balloon' from the location of Birmingham my contact page ranks 5th: http://www.balloon.co.uk/contact.htm but the home page ranks nowhere. So - it's gone from ranking 1st nationally to ranking nowhere with my contact page ranking above the home page (which is a generic word domain). Any ideas?
Algorithm Updates | | balloon.co.uk0 -
Panda, Negative SEO and now Penguin - help needed
Hi,
Algorithm Updates | | mlm12
We are small business owners who've been running a website for 5 years that provides our income. We've done very little backlinking ourselves, and never did paid directories or anything like that - usually just occasional forum or blog responses. A few articles here and there with some of our keyword phrases for internal pages. Of course I admit we've done some kwp backlinks on some blogs, but our anchor text profile is largely brand names and our domain name and non keywords (excepting for some "bad" backlinks). Our DA is 34, PA 45 for our home page. We were doing great until last Sept 27 when we got hit by Panda and have been working on deoptimizing our site for keywords, we made a new site in Wordpress for good architecture and ease of use for our customers, and we're deleting/repurposing low quality pages and making our content more robust. We haven't yet recovered from this and now it appears we got hit May 22 for Penguin...ARGH! I recently discovered (hard to have time to devote to everything with just two of us) that others can "negative seo" a site now and I feel this has happened based upon results below... I signed up for linkdetox.com yesterday and it gives a grim picture of our backlinks (says we are in "deadly risk" territory). We have 83 "toxic" links and 600 some "suspicious" links (many are in malware/malicious listed sites, many are .pl domains from Poland, others are I believe foreign domains, or domains that are a bunch or letters that make no sense, or spammy sounding emd domains), - this makes up 80% of our links. As this is our only business, our income is now 1/3 of what it has been, even with PPC ads going as we've been hit hard by all of this and are wondering if we can survive fixing this. We do have an SEO firm minimally helping us along with guidance on recovering, but with income so low, we are doing the work ourselves and can't afford much. Needless to say, we are quite distressed and from reading around, not sure if we'll be able to recover and that is deeply saddening, especially from Negative SEO. We want to make sure we are on the right path for recovery if possible, hence my questions. We haven't been in contact with Google for reconsideration, again, no penalty messages from them. First of all, if we don't have a manual penalty, would you still contact all the toxic/malicious/possible porn looking sites and ask for a link removal, wait, ask for link removal, wait then disavow? Or just go straight to Google disavow? For backlinks coming from sites that are "gone" (like a message saying the account has been suspended), or there is no website there anymore, do I try and contact them too? Or go direct to disavow? Or do nothing? For the sites flagged as malicious (by linkdetox, my browser, or by Google), I don't want to try and open them on my browser to see if this site is legitimate. If linkdetox doesn't have the contact info for these - what are we supposed to do? For "suspicious" foreign sites that I can't read the webpage -would you still disavow them (I've seen many here say links from foreign sites should be disavowed). How do you keep up with all this is someone is negative SEOing you? We're really frustrated that Google's change has made it possible for competitors to tank your business (arguably though, if we had a stronger backlink profile this may not have hurt, or not as much - not sure). When you are small biz owners and can't hire a group to constantly monitor backlinks, get quality backlinks, content, site optimization, etc - it seems an almost impossible task to do. Are wordpress left nav and footer link anchor text an issue for Penguin? I would think Google would realize these internal links will be repetitive for the same anchor text on Wordpress (I know Matt Cutts said to not use the same anchor text more than once for internal linking -but obviously nav and footer menus will do this). What would you do if this was you? Try and fix it all? Start over with a new domain and 301 it (some say this has been working)? Just start over with a new domain and don't redirect? Thanks for your input and advice. We appreciate it.0 -
Ranking effected by Penguin 2.0
Hello Everyone, I am amazed to see that all the ranking of keywords got down after Penguin webspam algorithm updated on May 22, 2013. Is there any suggestion how we will recover and get the ranking back. Thanks
Algorithm Updates | | lucidsoftech0 -
Rank Tracking & Personalized Search
How effective is rank tracking when google tends to deliver personalized search? I tend to clear out my browser of all info, cookies and cache so I can get the best results but how effective are rank tracking algo's in delivering accurate results. I run various apps and tests and I get different results.
Algorithm Updates | | bronxpad0 -
How did my Page Authority and Page Rank disappear?
I've hit a problem. A couple days ago my site's page authority was 51 and the PR was 3 and now they're 1 and 0 respectively. The developer did adjust some of the code in the site in the past couple days but that shouldn't have affected this. It was last cached by Google on the 5th. Can anyone offer some good advice? If it helps the page is www.duracard.com
Algorithm Updates | | Andrea.G0 -
Can Google display a diffrent page title?
Hi if I search google UK for the phrase car leasing, google returns my listing as Car Lease Deals However the same search on Yahoo or Bing bring back Contract Hire | Vehicle & Car Leasing Deals | Car Lease Deals this is the real page title. Why would this happen? Thanks Andy
Algorithm Updates | | First-VehicleLeasing0