Why was I hit by the above the fold algo?
-
I cannot find any decent information on this update. Everybody appears to reiterate what Matt Cutts posted. I understand what the update was 'supposed' to combat and achieve. I also understand what those abusing ads above the fold, are supposed to do. But I need to know what to do, when you don't have too many ads above the fold.
One of my websites was hit. Several professionals have tried to convince me it was Panda, that was released on 18th January. But I am now 99.9% certain it wasn't.
I'm in the UK, traffic on the 18th was normal, little better than expected actually. Traffic on the 19th was normal until around 10pm GMT and there as a noticeable dip, compared with previous days and weeks.
January 20th continued this decline and at the end of the day, there was a 25% loss.
I have 1 Google ad, that is above the fold. Most of the pages have no ads at all. No affiliates or anything else. I have always prided myself in keeping my website clean and ad free.
We also have the lowest bounce rates in the niche, by a mile, as far as I can tell, from speaking to other webmasters.
I cannot remove this 1 ad, the servers alone, cost a couple of grand. The advertising supports the website.
Nothing I can find online, gives me any indicators, as to what might be tripping this filter. But I need to figure it out, as traffic has now reached a 50% loss, which equates to about 15,000 visitors per day.
I have tore my pages apart, removed functionality, added functionality and yet traffic has continued to decline.
Can anybody shed light on this? I worry that perhaps Google is seeing the images on my website as ads. The images open a bigger preview in lightbox, but with JS turned off, opens a new page, with nothing but the image on it.
I am at my wits end. Any help would be greatly appreciated.
Paul
-
That link is really bothering me. I have never personally used that dirty piece of software, and I've contacted the guy who owns the website several times asking him to remove that link.
It appears other links have been built without my knowledge but nothing OTT. So I don't think that's the issue. The drop on Jan 20th is just too much of a coincidence.
I've lost over $20k. Fortunately Adsense ecpm is a lot higher, after decreasing bounce rate etc.
Despite how it may appear, I've actually got quite a lot of experience fixing Google penalties. This is the first time I've ever been stumped and with it being my own site and getting desperate, I've made some choices against my better judgement.
I've also hired a couple of other SEO's, which is actually how I ended up on a wild goose chase, trying to combat Panda, when I was certain it wasn't the issue.
I did submit a reconsideration request and got the automated response that there was no manual penalties. I may take the loss and remove the ads for a week, at the end of the day, I need to get to the bottom of it.
Thanks a lot for all your input Ryan.
-
Paul,
I agree with you that tearing up your site was likely a mistake. I would suggest restoring your page to represent the page both you and your members loved.
It is my opinion we have reached the limit of what can be done in a Q&A. What you have described is an across-the-board drop in rankings on or about Jan 19th. To diagnose and repair the penalty your options are:
-
hire a professional SEO consultant
-
continue to make guesses and tear up your site
If you were to stay on your current course, I would make the following suggestions:
-submit a Reconsideration Request just to ensure you have not been hit with a manual penalty. If Google responds with the standard message indicating you have not been manually penalized, then take comfort in knowing you are just dealing with the normal algorithm and can focus on it.
-
you are clearly familiar with the ATF update (http://googlewebmastercentral.blogspot.com/2012/01/page-layout-algorithm-improvement.html). If you are so sure that is the problem, there is a very easy way to test! Remove the ads for a time period and see if your rankings are restored.
-
based on the feedback you have already received from other SEOs, you can try improving your content. Do it in such a way that would truly benefit users, not in a manner to appease the search engines
-
lastly, have you considered other possibilities? For example, your site may have a link penalty. When I checked OSE your first link shows as: http://dbpmarketing.com/senuke/senuke-x-review/
According to the page:
| Name: | SENuke X |
| Creators: | Joe Russell & Areeb Bajwa |
| Focus: | Automated Link Building |Your link profile shows clear signs of manipulation and your links did increase at exactly the time you were penalized.
5+ months of lost traffic = how much revenue? Or asked another way, how much revenue do you need to lose before you consider hiring someone with experience resolving Google penalties?
-
-
Hi Ryan, the site was hitting 30,000 uniques a day. The pages are very image heavy and also serve tens of thousands of downloads a day. We have 2 quad core servers, with 28GB ram. 1 is a dedicated web server and the other dedicated SQL. We also have a dedicated, but much less powerful backup server and finally 20TB traffic allowance.
The blog page in question, wasn't supposed to target any terms. It was to boost morale while traffic is down. I appreciate I could have still targeted terms but I figured I'd just tone things down a little. Most of the other pages are highly targeted. http://www.tehkseven.net/theme/nokia-c3-themes.html for example, is targeting Nokia C3 Themes.
The download page is currently a complete, utter mess. It was previously very similar to this: https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.rockstar.gta3&feature=top-paid#?t=W251bGwsMSwxLDIwNiwiY29tLnJvY2tzdGFyLmd0YTMiXQ..
But after losing so much traffic on January 20th, I've ripped it inside out. I removed the large intro banner that members usually spent hours designing, moved text around the page, moved the ad up, down, left and right. It's rather sad and my members aren't pleased that the pages which display their work, have been destroyed, but they are fortunately supportive and understanding of the situation.
I need to start putting it back together and pay extra attention to keeping the ad below the fold, while focusing on my users. As much as I want to fix this issue, destroying my website in the process, isn't what I want to do.
Our bounce rates are 20-30%, which are among the best in the niche, we average 12 page views and 8-9 minutes per visit. Yet none of this seems to matter, all Google cares about is this bloody advert.
I'll checkout the Wikipedia page, thanks.
-
Paul, take a look at this URL for example: http://www.tehkseven.net/blog/1/entry-1164-daily-inspiration-1/
Some positive notes: it appears to be authentic, original content and your community members are responding to it.
Question - what is this page supposed to rank for? Since this page is linked to from an above the fold area of your home page it must be important, right? It does not appear your site is large enough to earn branded searches. For example, SEOmoz "Whiteboard Friday" has been around long enough and attracted enough interest to show signs of a brand. The term earns 1600 Global Monthly Searches.
Try this: look at your various mobile theme pages and ignore the page title. How long does it take to figure out what the page focus is? Ideally the answer should be one second. Instead, the actual focus of the page is often not found in the content, or if it is found it is not in the Description area above the above but rather in the auto-generated text below the large ad.
By the way...opportunity for your site: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phone_theme I would suggest adding HIGH QUALITY, HELPFUL content to the wiki page and providing your site as the source.
On another note...
**the servers alone, cost a couple of grand. **
In re-reading your original Q&A this just hit me. What kind of hosting do you have? The performance of your site is not that of a dedicated server. Based on the performance I would guess you use a VPS but your costs should be under 1k US per year.
-
Hi Ryan, I must ask what you mean by "unfocused" content. Do you mean unfocused in that the subject matter for a theme is unrelated to the next? Or do you have an issue with the architecture of the website? Cheers
-
Hi Ryan, I'm not looking for confirmation, I think it's a given, that ATF is the update that hurt us. Sorry for lack of info, finally at a PC now.
I agree regarding the alt text of the attachments. We are using invision power board and on the attachments system they use terrible alt text. It's likely possible to hack though. In this niche, the top sites all lack textual content an I believe Google is smart enough to understand that.
What I was hoping for, is for somebody to be able to look at the page with the ad and say "oh yes, there's your issue, I've seen this before'. Wishful thinking?
The drop in traffic is site wide and the drop in ranking appears to be across the board too. The drops aren't typical of a normal penalty, we've not been knocked back several pages, just all pages dropped several spots, which has had a devastating effect.
It's not any specific content type, or section of the site. The entire site was hit late Jan 19th, GMT, which would be midday US. If there's any information I can provide, that you feel may assist you in offering help, please ask and I'll provide it.
-
Paul, you are not sharing enough info for anyone to be able to assist you.
Take a step back and look at this Q&A. You have shared:
-
you are 99% sure you have been hit by the ATF algorithm change
-
you are confident you are not affected by Panda
I had to pull even basic info such as the site URL. We have no information about your traffic drop other then the date. What assistance do you desire? Are you really seeking to resolve the root issue? Or do you just want someone to confirm your diagnosis?
Based on what I am seeing, I am highly concerned about your extremely thin and unfocused content. Example page of one of the site's themes: http://www.tehkseven.net/theme/109507/summertime-mobile-theme.html
To make matters worse, the image ALT text is either missing or exceptionally poor. An example of ALT text on the above page "Attached Image: 1.png"
-
-
Hi Ryan, thanks for taking the time to look, once again replying via my iPhone. So please excuse lack of formatting. Ad is on the download page, click any item in the gallery. Prior no major changes other than an update in the cms which did introduce a couple of duplicate content issues that were quickly fixed. But since I have noindexed a lot of content and traffic has spiralled. My gut tells me that this ATF update works on a sliding scale, based on the ratio of pages with the offending ads. My noindexing pages without the ad, has increased that ratio.
-
I viewed your site and did not notice the Google ad you mentioned. Has it been disabled?
I noticed some content issues as you mentioned but did not see anything else which immediately stood out. Further analysis of your analytics is necessary. Exactly HOW has your traffic dropped? Did it drop across the board? Or are there some keywords or pages which experienced a drop while others remain unaffected? Did rankings drop?
What changes were made in the 60 days before the drop?
-
Grr seomoz isn't mobile friendly. It's stripped all the formatting. Sorry for the long sentances.
-
Hi Ryan, I avoided posting the URL, as over on the Google forums, I found people got caught up in details, such as low text content etc. But I'm hoping we won't do that here. URL: http://goo.gl/UDTIw The low text is a problem for the entire niche and we go way beyond what 99% of our competitors do. I'm 99.9% sure the issue is from the ATF update. Since Jan 20th, I have changed a lot. But as I say, this has to be in some way related to ads.
-
Another obvious question is : did you change anything recently?
-
Without the ability to at least look at your web page, we are truly flying blind. I cannot see how any helpful advice can be offered without, at a minimum, examining your site.
Got a burning SEO question?
Subscribe to Moz Pro to gain full access to Q&A, answer questions, and ask your own.
Browse Questions
Explore more categories
-
Moz Tools
Chat with the community about the Moz tools.
-
SEO Tactics
Discuss the SEO process with fellow marketers
-
Community
Discuss industry events, jobs, and news!
-
Digital Marketing
Chat about tactics outside of SEO
-
Research & Trends
Dive into research and trends in the search industry.
-
Support
Connect on product support and feature requests.
Related Questions
-
Call for Help. Hit Badly with "Medic" and another 30% Loss with Sept 28th Update
Hi Everyone, I am not sure how this is all happening. We have been online for about 15 years, and now we are at our lowest amount of traffic in about 10 years. Our sites are www.bestpricenutrition.com and www.mysupplementstore.com. We sell commodity items, but I have focused on unique product descriptions, tons of UGC, blog posts and guides for awhile now and it has always done us well. Until as of late. This is what I feel led up to this, but I am hoping there is something I missed. May 1st, 2018: Migrated www.bestpricenutrition.com and www.mysupplementstore.com from Shopify. Similar sites, but almost all unique content. We purchased www.mysupplementstore.com about 8 years ago. A ton of traffic and sales, which is why we didn't just redirect it. Around May 25th: www.mysupplementstore.com took a big hit and lost almost 40% of its traffic. Nothing happened to www.bestpricenutrition.com, we actually increased traffic. Aug 1st Update: www.mysupplementstore.com lost another 25% of its traffic. www.bestpricenutrition.com lost about 40% of it's traffic. Sept 28th: Nothing happened to www.mysupplementstore.com, but www.bestpricenutrition.com lost another 30% of it's traffic. So I have been trying to figure out if there is anything technically wrong, but doesn't seem so. These are issues we discovered in August. During the migration, the reviews from each site were syndicated to both websites. There were 1000's. This was resolved in mid August. During the migration, the company doing the migration pushed our blog posts to both websites. 100's of blog posts duplicated to each website. This was resolved mid August. We found that a disgruntled employee instead writing unique content for our product pages, she was copying them one from another. This was about 100 product pages, which we have since resolved. What's Left I noticed on www.bestpricenutrition.com that we have 100's of blog posts that are getting hardly any traffic. I had trimmed www.mysupplementstore.com of this low traffic content. I am working on www.bestpricenutrition.com still. I have been in this industry since 2003, survived 2012, but have exhausted everything I know to figure this out. It's another sob story I know, but trying to keep everyone's job alive here, but it doesn't look like it's going to happen. Any help would be greatly appreciated.
Intermediate & Advanced SEO | | vetofunk0 -
72KB CSS code directly in the page header (not in external CSS file). Done for faster "above the fold" loading. Any problem with this?
To optimize for googles page speed, our developer has moved the 72KB CSS code directly in the page header (not in external CCS file). This way the above the fold loading time was reduced. But may this affect indexing of the page or have any other negative side effects on rankings? I made a quick test and google cache seems to have our full pages cached, but may it affect somehow negatively our rankings or that google indexes fewer of our pages (here we have some problems with google ignoring about 30% of our pages in our sitemap".)
Intermediate & Advanced SEO | | lcourse0 -
Google Mobile algo traffic issue?
Hello, I have just been approach by a website owner - site isn't mobile friendly in any way - and they've seen a significant fall off in traffic since 23 Jan... backlink profile is clean (and no linkbuilding undertaken) - nothing else has changed... - more than half their traffic is via mobile devices and they've lost a good 1/3 of their traffic - and drilling deeper it's their organic traffic that's been hit. Anybody else seeing similar? edit... for reference: https://www.davidnaylor.co.uk/google-released-mobile-algorithm-think.html
Intermediate & Advanced SEO | | McTaggart0 -
Penguin hit Website - Moving to new domain
Hey! I am working on a Penguin hit Website. Still ranking for all brand keywords and blog articles are still being returned in Google SERPs, but the website is showing up for only 3 or 4 money keywords. It is clearly a penguin hit as it was ranked 1st page for all money keywords before latest update (3.0). We already did a link cleanup and disavowed all bad backlinks. Still, the recovery process could take over 2 years from previous experience, and in 2 years, the site will suffer a slow death. Solution: We own the .com version of the domain, currently being served on the .net. We bought the .com version about 6 years ago, it is clean and NOT redirected to the .net (actual site). We were thinking about moving the whole Website to the .com version to start over. However, we need to make sure Google doesn't connect the 2 sites (no pagerank flow). Of course Google will notice is the same content, but there won't be any pagerank flowing from the old site to the new one. For this, we thought about the following steps: Block Googlebot (and only googlebot) for the .net version via robots.txt. Wait until Google removes all URLs from the index. Move content to the .com version. Set a 301 redirect from .net to .com (without EVER removing the block on googlebot). Thoughts? Has anyone went over this before? Other ideas? Thanks!
Intermediate & Advanced SEO | | FedeEinhorn0 -
Was my site hit by Panda or Penguin? Looking for diagnosis help
My URL is: www.westlakedermatology.com Hello Mozers, I'm looking for some help or guidance as to why my site fell off the "rankings cliff" on 9/5. In the forums I hear a lot of others with a similar issue, and some speculation it is due to a Panda refresh. However, looking at our site we have unique content with each page having over 300-400 words (so it's not light or duplicate content). We get a lot of leads that verbally tell us our content helped answer some of their questions so I'm pretty confident its good for users. Can anyone see an issue with the content on our site? In terms of Penguin, I think our backlink profile is clean, our physicians do take part in providing content to various high quality and relevant websites/blogs. But we do not buy links or do anything in violation of Google's guidelines. In terms of brand, we are the biggest dermatology and plastic surgery group in the Austin area. So any brand implications to search should be on our side. Just looking for some sort of guidance or help, any suggestions would be great! Thanks,
Intermediate & Advanced SEO | | iderma
Adam Paddock0 -
Hit hard on Google last October.
Hi all, I'm just wondering if anyone is able to help me with why my website lost practically all its ranking last October (2012). My website is here: http://bit.ly/nAOfNj Since early 2010, we have been ranking in the top 3 for our keyword when searched all around the country. Between end September, and end October 2012, we started dropping (from 2nd to 8th, then in December, 13th, January, 18th place... and then March back up to 13th, now ~10th). The main problem seems to be that Google has changed how websites rank for our keyword (trampoline). In Brisbane, Australia (where we are based), we only rank in the local organic searches. We don't have a separate listing there anymore (with the meta description), even though we had a normal organic listing (and local listing) for the last 2 years! When searching from other states/suburbs further away, we dropped way off the first page. Our product is sold by resellers in 400 stores around Australia, so its not like we're just in Brisbane. Has anyone experienced Google changing how they return results for a specific keyword like this? Did they do it a lot towards the end of last year? We have a place page for Brisbane, but for some reason I have little to no control over it (Places/Local+ stuff up means I can't manage the page on Local+, can't add pictures/videos etc). My boss suggested we even try deleting the maps page or our local+ page to get out of there. We don't get anywhere near as much traffic through the local listing than a normal listing... I'm not sure if that's best though? From what I can tell, the only Google algorithm updates that may have affected us at the time (October 9th) were the page layout updates that penalised(?) sites that have a lot of "ads" above the fold. Our website is designed to have splash banners on the top of every page to either promote our own product, competitions or the athletes we sponsor. Up until last week, the banners were always 500px high on larger screen desktops and 300px high on smaller desktops, laptops, ipad etc. I have recently changed them to all be 300px high to test, but I imagine i'll have to wait a while? Is this the kind of content that Google means by "ads above the fold"? I've spent the last 4 weeks working on our SEO, from HTML validation, to rich snippets, content optimisation, a lot more internal linking, setting up some location-based content, doing a lot of keyword research, and now starting to work on cleaning up our Blog and creating some real sharable content that we'll share on our Facebook. I really just wish I knew where the problem was so I could tackle that 😞 Any advice would be GREATLY appreciated!!
Intermediate & Advanced SEO | | Vuly0 -
I was hit bad by Penguin on 4-24-12.
I was hit bad by Penguin on 4-24-12. Never received a bad link warning from Google but I do have lots of bad links from a SEO company years ago. I canceled with them and they kept sending automated links with the same anchor text. I even asked Google to remove the bad links years before the penguin update I have removed many bad links by contacting webmasters and have used disavowal tool twice. 6 Months later still no improvement. Is it possible that Google needs more time to disavowal bad links ? What about 301 redirect to a new domain? Anyone ever have long term success with 301. What about 301 after using the disavowal tool any luck? What about changing my domain, will it take months for site to move up, anyone with experience trying this? Let me know any ideas. Thanks
Intermediate & Advanced SEO | | DWatters0 -
How to find pages hardest hit
I have been hearing that panda can penalize a website for low quality pages. I have run duplicate content check and done my best to go through the whole website. I hear many people talking about deleting hardest hit pages, or fixing hardest hit pages. My question is how can I find which pages on our website are hardest hit? Is there anyway to check a website for pages that might score low. We do have a ecom section to the website which I am concerned might be considered low quality for each product page. Any advice would be a great help.
Intermediate & Advanced SEO | | fertilityhealth0