How much keyword density for Google?
-
I have several pages on one site which have gone down during the past few months. They keyword density on those pages, which is not unnatural, pleased Google for many years. it still pleases Bing. But Google now seems very picky.
Based upon your experience, what is the ideal % keyword density for 2 and 3 word phrases, and should they be left out of alt tags even when proper to put them there?
While Google dominates, we do not wish to alienate BIng/Yahoo.
It is a huge mystery, and experimentation with more non-keyword-related text has so far not born any fruit.
Thank you,
GH
-
I realize this is an old thread, but I came across it when looking for an answer to the question, "What is the ideal keyword density for SEO?" After reading several high-ranking pages on the subject (most of which did not or could not provide an answer), I came up with what I believe to be an answer: The ideal keyword density for a given web page is either: (1) one keyword less than what would cause a visitor of the page to form an opinion that the page is not a credible source of information for that keyword, or (2) one keyword less than what would cause Google to form an opinion that the page is not a credible source of information for that keyword.
Now, I'll leave it to someone better at math to calculate what exactly that number is.
-
It's amazing that everyone here has answers, but no data. If you're going to give an answer, back it up. User-readable? Yes. Documented by Google. No copy? Links only? Works for some sites like CNN, ToysRUs, Walmart that get picked up just because they're huge (observation). But for the majority of the little guys, content plays a role and it would be great to know if the data supports keyword density as still being applicable to G. Tools still measure it (SEOQuake). In natural language, it seems to make sense that a certain percentage of words, on average, are repeated. Google has made it clear that they are trying to master how language is actually used in the real world and providing results based on how humans communicate, not computers. Thus, more people focus, less computer focus. YET, we all know that computers still play a huge role in how SERPs choose winners. We just have to find the balance, right?
-
Thank you for the link, which is useful, but I was surprised to find many very code-heavy sites (14%) ranking at the top as well, even in the era of the "thin page" penalty. The factors and changes in algorithms used are simply overwhelming, so I guess my answer simply lies in making the best site possible and giving up on SEO considerations almost entirely.
-
I still consider keyword density as a litmus test for how I expect spiders to consider my pages. Even more important, but touching on the same concepts as keyword density, is the text-to-code ratio.
http://www.seochat.com/seo-tools/code-to-text-ratio/
And this is something I do spend time optimizing for. With all of the analytical scripts, forms, nestled navigation bars, etc, on a standard site, it's easy to become code-heavy and be penalized for it.
-
I agree with Tom. When it comes to keyword density, ask yourself if it comes off natural, then ask a friend to read the copy. Ask him or her, does it come off natural and would they accept this for copy on a website.
-
Thank you.
You are likely right that there are other off-page issues Google may be taking into account to penalize our white hat site, though they are a mystery to me, as our link profile is very strong according to SEOMOZ, especially compared to much larger competitors. We even have pages which once ranked in the top 5, and which SEOMOZ claims have a very high authority, which have disappeared completely from the Google index (for all intents and purposes, except for precise search of the title).
I suppose that limiting links to other content on the page which use the keywords may be the next step, and largely ignoring the words I am trying to convey. Unlearning everything that worked for 10 years in SEO and still works with Bing (which is providing me personally with better answers to general questions, by the way).
-
Thank you. I agree, but have certainly seen sites (other my own) which go right to the top of the SERPS due to keyword density, as they have little content and no backlinks, so it does still seem to me to be a matter of some concern. If you don't mention keywords, how is an algorithm supposed to know what the page is about or is emphasizing on a site with thousands of pages?
Thank you again for your response.
-
I don't think you can put a general % on keyword density. So long as it reads well and doesn't appeared to be stuffed, it should be fine. Mention it as many times as you can without it appearing forced. There's no doubt that having a keyword appear more times on the page will help Google deduce what the page is about, but similarly anything that would compromise a user experience or attempts to over-optimise for the algorithm can easily be penalised. Saying what number this is though is highly dependent on context, so you can't put a broad figure on an "optimal level"
If you haven't changed the density on the page, I don't believe that your density level would have caused a fall in your rankings (unless it was overdone, as said before). The strength this signal has on your rankings would be small at best, so there's very likely another reason for the fall. I'd start looking at other on-page factors and especially what sort of links you might have earned recently (or indeed lost).
-
There is no longer such thing as "keyword density". This should not be part of any SEO startegy.
Calculating this is a waste of time.
There are pages that rank without having the keyword on the page - seomoz has a good blog post on the subject by Rand I think.
It dose help to have the keyword on url and in the title tag and in h1 and at least once in the actual content but there is no magic formula.
I hate the statement "what is good for the user" as it is over used ny Google but in this case it dose make sense - it can be used once or 10 times or 100 times in the page as long as it make sense for the user and if you read the text is natural and no forced sentences or words. Synonyms of the word or alternative of the phrase are also a very good choice and google can associate those very well.
Personally I never take this in consideration to any of the projects - I used to (back in 2004-2005) when it was important but now based on industry opinions, google's statements and personal tests there is no magic formula and no help if you work on keyword density.
My 2 cents. Hope it helps.
Got a burning SEO question?
Subscribe to Moz Pro to gain full access to Q&A, answer questions, and ask your own.
Browse Questions
Explore more categories
-
Moz Tools
Chat with the community about the Moz tools.
-
SEO Tactics
Discuss the SEO process with fellow marketers
-
Community
Discuss industry events, jobs, and news!
-
Digital Marketing
Chat about tactics outside of SEO
-
Research & Trends
Dive into research and trends in the search industry.
-
Support
Connect on product support and feature requests.
Related Questions
-
Keyword strategy for wordpress category base blog in competitive industry
Hi friends, We have a client in the movie review blog industry, which we are aware is highly competitive, but we have tons of content (over 10,000 unique posts) and a good team of reviewers for fresh content. I was wondering about any input on keyword variations for our SEO Title of our wordpress main categories, like "Movie Reviews". I was thinking a modification to "Latest Movie Reviews", but the competition is only slightly less, and still seems questionable for attaining eventual rankings. "Best Movie Reviews" is slightly higher than "Latest Movie Reviews" but the competition still seems tough. What would be a good long term strategy with these category pages, any suggestions?
Competitive Research | | JustinMurray0 -
Searching for keywords
Good morning, Is there a reliable tool which would give me estimate on how many people are searching for some keyword? Thank you very much, Iris
Competitive Research | | Rebeca10 -
Different SERP results in browsers / different result pages for keyword in browser
Hi, I am making the SEO reports for a travel agency and I have the following problem. SEOmoz shows me the website is on page 1, for a keyword. Yesterday, a google search with firefox showed me the same position, while, searching from a different computer on google using firefox gave me another position. The URL shown was also different. I asked some friends to do the search - the results were the same - first page. Today, firefox shows me the second URL on the 4'th page, and the result from the first page of google does not appear, while Chrome still shows me the first URL on the first page. I have no idea why the URL that was ranking well does not appear on the first page with Firefox, and why it appears on the first page with Chrome, or why the URL that was ranking bad -meaning page 4, appears on Firefox but does not appear on Chrome. Can someone give me some advice?
Competitive Research | | Netlogiq0 -
Unjustified ratings and reviews in google SERP?
I was checking Google US for some search term my company is interested for and found a thing I cannot explain well. The site Tradecarview is shown with a rating of 4.4 stars from 4209 reviews. (Please see attached image).The same rating is shown on their homepage, but I could not find much more details. (By the way: Tradecarview is a sort of directory for used car dealers to post their vehicles, something similar to Ebay or Yahoo motors.) The question is simple: is Google trusting the ratings given directly on the website? Maybe just summarizing the ratings shown here? http://www.tradecarview.com/pr/providerlist.aspx?pn=0&st=7 Or are there other sources I couldn't find that Google used to specify the rating? What do you think? Thank you in advance for your answers, Dario Pe1ft.jpg
Competitive Research | | Darioz0 -
Best methodology for creating local keywords when Google has no data?
Generally I'll look at data for specific geographical searches and incorporate the data from the other keywords, then track the metrics. I think there is likely a more efficient system but I'm not sure where to start.
Competitive Research | | DoriC0 -
Excel Concatenate Function for Google Places?
I'm trying to expedite my research by using the concatenate function. How should the search URL be modified to trigger a google places search as opposed to a normal search. Thanks!
Competitive Research | | BlueFountainMedia0 -
What does 70% Keyword Difficulty mean in reality?
I did a quick search in SEOmoz keyword difficuilty tool and found out most of the keyword I pick with some nice traffic are all 70%. Keyword list: http://screencast.com/t/Y4pPK42ZXrST How "difficult" is 70%? If someone ask you to optimize and rank a (very) new website for a keyword with 70% difficulty: Will you take the challedge or you think mission impossible? Why? How do you relate this reletively abstract "number" to the real world? Thank you!
Competitive Research | | johnzhel0 -
Sometime I just don't get Google rankings
We currently rate #10 on google.com.au on Modern Cloth Nappies and the #4 site is a dead link to a page http://www.modernclothnappies.org/ who's total content is: Index of / <address>Apache Server at www.modernclothnappies.org Port 80</address> <address></address> <address>They have been at that rank for a quiet a while and even the cached version is full of broken links.</address> <address></address> <address>It seems Google is quick to jump on low value sites or ones with duplicate content, but what about stale links and sites? Has anyone else had similar experiences of being out ranked by domant or dead sites?</address>
Competitive Research | | oznappies0